Stacey Abrams: I Do Not Believe That You Run For Second Place | Morning Joe | MSNBC

WE HAVE >>> WE'RE BACK NOW WITH FORMER
>>> WE'RE BACK NOW WITH FORMER DEMOCRATIC GEORGIA GUBERNATORIAL
DEMOCRATIC GEORGIA GUBERNATORIAL NOMINEE STACEY ABRAMS.
NOMINEE STACEY ABRAMS. SHE'S THE AUTHOR OF "LEAD FROM
SHE'S THE AUTHOR OF "LEAD FROM THE OUTSIDE, HOW TO BUILD YOUR
THE OUTSIDE, HOW TO BUILD YOUR FUTURE AND MAKE REAL CHANGE."
FUTURE AND MAKE REAL CHANGE." WE'VE GOT FOR
WE'VE GOT FOR STACEY ABRAMS.
STACEY ABRAMS. >> GOOD MORNING.
>> GOOD MORNING. >> I SAW THAT YOU SAID RECENTLY
>> I SAW THAT YOU SAID RECENTLY THAT I BELIEVE IDENTITY POLITICS
THAT I BELIEVE IDENTITY POLITICS ARE THE POLITICS THAT WIN AND
ARE THE POLITICS THAT WIN AND THAT MAKES SENSE TO ME IN THE
THAT MAKES SENSE TO ME IN THE CONTEXT OF A DEMOCRATIC PRIMARY
CONTEXT OF A DEMOCRATIC PRIMARY BUT I WONDER HOW YOU APPLY THAT
BUT I WONDER HOW YOU APPLY THAT AGAINST DONALD TRUMP IN THOSE
AGAINST DONALD TRUMP IN THOSE MID WESTERN STATES THAT HE LOST
MID WESTERN STATES THAT HE LOST IN 2016.
IN 2016. >> IDENTITY MATTER TO EVERYONE.
>> IDENTITY MATTER TO EVERYONE. THERE'S A SPECIFIC IDENTITY WE
THERE'S A SPECIFIC IDENTITY WE ATTRIBUTE TO VOTERS IN THE
ATTRIBUTE TO VOTERS IN THE MIDWEST AND MY ARGUMENT IS YOU
MIDWEST AND MY ARGUMENT IS YOU CAN'T EXCLUDE ONE GROUP TO FOCUS
CAN'T EXCLUDE ONE GROUP TO FOCUS ON ANOTHER.
ON ANOTHER. WE HAVE TO HAVE AN INCLUSIVE
WE HAVE TO HAVE AN INCLUSIVE POLITICS THAT SEES NOT ONLY THE
POLITICS THAT SEES NOT ONLY THE VALUES OF PEOPLE, BUT ACTUALLY
VALUES OF PEOPLE, BUT ACTUALLY THEIR VOTES AS VALUABLE.
THEIR VOTES AS VALUABLE. AND THAT MEANS YOU CANNOT IGNORE
AND THAT MEANS YOU CANNOT IGNORE THOSE WHO FACE BARRIERS TO THEIR
THOSE WHO FACE BARRIERS TO THEIR POINT OF ENTRY AS VOTERS AND YOU
POINT OF ENTRY AS VOTERS AND YOU CAN'T IGNORE THE ISSUES FACED BY
CAN'T IGNORE THE ISSUES FACED BY THOSE WHO HAVE MARGINALIZED
THOSE WHO HAVE MARGINALIZED IDENTITIES BECAUSE YOU'RE AFRAID
IDENTITIES BECAUSE YOU'RE AFRAID THAT YOU'RE GOING TO LOSE THE
THAT YOU'RE GOING TO LOSE THE NORMAL MID WESTERN VOTER.
NORMAL MID WESTERN VOTER. WHAT WE WERE ABLE TO PROVE IN
WHAT WE WERE ABLE TO PROVE IN GEORGIA IS YOU CAN CENTER
GEORGIA IS YOU CAN CENTER COMMUNITIES OF COLOR, AND PICK
COMMUNITIES OF COLOR, AND PICK UP WHITE VOTERS WHICH I WHAT I
UP WHITE VOTERS WHICH I WHAT I DID.
DID. I INCREASED THE WHITE VOTE SHARE
I INCREASED THE WHITE VOTE SHARE IN DEMOCRATS FOR THE FIRST TIME
IN DEMOCRATS FOR THE FIRST TIME IN A GENERATION BECAUSE I NOT
IN A GENERATION BECAUSE I NOT ONLY ACKNOWLEDGED THE NEEDS OF
ONLY ACKNOWLEDGED THE NEEDS OF COMMUNITIES OF COLOR, I ALSO
COMMUNITIES OF COLOR, I ALSO ACKNOWLEDGED THE NEEDS OF WHITE
ACKNOWLEDGED THE NEEDS OF WHITE VOTERS.
VOTERS. I ACKNOWLEDGED THE FACT THAT OUR
I ACKNOWLEDGED THE FACT THAT OUR WATER INFRASTRUCTURE IS WOEFULLY
WATER INFRASTRUCTURE IS WOEFULLY INADEQUATE AND WE HAD TO DO
INADEQUATE AND WE HAD TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT THAT.
SOMETHING ABOUT THAT. WE HAVE TO BE ABLE TO WALK AND
WE HAVE TO BE ABLE TO WALK AND CHEW GUM AND SNAP OUR FINGERS AT
CHEW GUM AND SNAP OUR FINGERS AT THE SAME TIME AND WE HAVE TO
THE SAME TIME AND WE HAVE TO TRUST THAT VOTERS DON'T CARE
TRUST THAT VOTERS DON'T CARE ABOUT SOMEONE ELSE HAVING
ABOUT SOMEONE ELSE HAVING THINGS.
THINGS. THEY CARE ABOUT US HAVING WHAT
THEY CARE ABOUT US HAVING WHAT THEY NEED AND IDENTITY POLITICS
THEY NEED AND IDENTITY POLITICS SIMPLY MEANS I SEE YOU.
SIMPLY MEANS I SEE YOU. I SEE THE BARRIERS TO YOUR
I SEE THE BARRIERS TO YOUR SUCCEED, THE NEEDS AND
SUCCEED, THE NEEDS AND OPPORTUNITIES THAT CAN BE MADE
OPPORTUNITIES THAT CAN BE MADE AVAILABLE AND WE HAVE TO HAVE
AVAILABLE AND WE HAVE TO HAVE CANDIDATES THAT CAN SPEAK
CANDIDATES THAT CAN SPEAK AUTHENTICALLY AND WITH
AUTHENTICALLY AND WITH AUTHENTICITY TO ALL OF THESE
AUTHENTICITY TO ALL OF THESE NEEDS AT THE SAME TIME.
NEEDS AT THE SAME TIME. I THINK VOTERS ARE SMART ENOUGH
I THINK VOTERS ARE SMART ENOUGH TO TRUST THAT YOU CAN SEE THEM
TO TRUST THAT YOU CAN SEE THEM AND NOT IGNORE EVERYONE ELSE.
AND NOT IGNORE EVERYONE ELSE. >> HEY, STACEY, GOOD TO TALK TO
>> HEY, STACEY, GOOD TO TALK TO YOU TODAY.
YOU TODAY. I KNOW THAT YOU MET WITH THE
I KNOW THAT YOU MET WITH THE FORMER VICE PRESIDENT JOE BIDEN.
FORMER VICE PRESIDENT JOE BIDEN. OBVIOUSLY YOU KNOW SOME OF THE
OBVIOUSLY YOU KNOW SOME OF THE ACCUSATIONS THAT HAVE BEEN
ACCUSATIONS THAT HAVE BEEN COMING OUT ABOUT HIS MAKING
COMING OUT ABOUT HIS MAKING WOMEN FEEL UNCOMFORTABLE.
WOMEN FEEL UNCOMFORTABLE. YOU'VE ALSO SEEN THE RESPONSE
YOU'VE ALSO SEEN THE RESPONSE THAT THEY PUT UP ON TWITTER.
THAT THEY PUT UP ON TWITTER. YESTERDAY THE VICE PRESIDENT'S
YESTERDAY THE VICE PRESIDENT'S RESPONSE ON TWITTER.
RESPONSE ON TWITTER. WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF IT IN HIS
WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF IT IN HIS RESPONSE.
RESPONSE. >> I AM FRIENDS WITH LUCY FLORES
>> I AM FRIENDS WITH LUCY FLORES AND I APPRECIATE HER BRINGING
AND I APPRECIATE HER BRINGING HER STORY FORWARD.
HER STORY FORWARD. I ALSO HAVE DEEP RESPECT FOR
I ALSO HAVE DEEP RESPECT FOR VICE PRESIDENT JOE BIDEN.
VICE PRESIDENT JOE BIDEN. WE CANNOT HAVE PERFECTION AS A
WE CANNOT HAVE PERFECTION AS A LITMUS TEST.
LITMUS TEST. THE RESPONSIBILITY OF LEADERS IS
THE RESPONSIBILITY OF LEADERS IS TO NOT BE PERFECT BUT TO BE
TO NOT BE PERFECT BUT TO BE ACCOUNTABLE TO SAY I'VE MADE A
ACCOUNTABLE TO SAY I'VE MADE A MISTAKE, I UNDERSTAND IT AND
MISTAKE, I UNDERSTAND IT AND HERE'S WHAT I'M GOING TO DO TO
HERE'S WHAT I'M GOING TO DO TO REFORM AS I MOVE FORWARD AND I
REFORM AS I MOVE FORWARD AND I THINK WE SEE JOE BIDEN DOING
THINK WE SEE JOE BIDEN DOING THAT.
THAT. I THINK THE VICE PRESIDENT HAS
I THINK THE VICE PRESIDENT HAS ACKNOWLEDGED THE DISCOMFORT THAT
ACKNOWLEDGED THE DISCOMFORT THAT HE'S CAUSED.
HE'S CAUSED. HE'S CREATED CONTEXT TO WHY THAT
HE'S CREATED CONTEXT TO WHY THAT IS HIS BEHAVIOR AND HE HAS
IS HIS BEHAVIOR AND HE HAS AFFIRMED THAT HE WILL DO
AFFIRMED THAT HE WILL DO SOMETHING DIFFERENT GOING
SOMETHING DIFFERENT GOING FORWARD.
FORWARD. WE'RE GOING TO FIND OUT
WE'RE GOING TO FIND OUT SOMETHING ABOUT EVERYBODY
SOMETHING ABOUT EVERYBODY RUNNING FOR OFFICE AND WE HAVE
RUNNING FOR OFFICE AND WE HAVE TO AS A PEOPLE BE READY TO
TO AS A PEOPLE BE READY TO FORGIVE BUT FORGIVENESS DOES NOT
FORGIVE BUT FORGIVENESS DOES NOT MEAN YOU ACCEPT IT UNLESS WHAT
MEAN YOU ACCEPT IT UNLESS WHAT YOU SEE IS ACCOUNTABILITY AND AN
YOU SEE IS ACCOUNTABILITY AND AN ATTEMPT AT REFORMATION SO THAT
ATTEMPT AT REFORMATION SO THAT MORE PEOPLE CAN FEEL INCLUDED
MORE PEOPLE CAN FEEL INCLUDED AND BELIEF THAT THEIR NEEDS WILL
AND BELIEF THAT THEIR NEEDS WILL BE MET.
BE MET. >> WE'VE SEEN THE REPORTS OVER
>> WE'VE SEEN THE REPORTS OVER THE LAST SEVERAL WEEKS THAT YOU
THE LAST SEVERAL WEEKS THAT YOU AND VICE PRESIDENT BIDEN HAS
AND VICE PRESIDENT BIDEN HAS TALKED ABOUT A JOINT TICKET.
TALKED ABOUT A JOINT TICKET. ARE THOSE REPORTS ACCURATE?
ARE THOSE REPORTS ACCURATE? >> NOT AT ALL.
>> NOT AT ALL. >> YOU HAVEN'T HAD ANY
>> YOU HAVEN'T HAD ANY CONVERSATIONS WITH JOE BIDEN
CONVERSATIONS WITH JOE BIDEN WITH THAT?
WITH THAT? >> I HAVEN'T HAD CONVERSATIONS
>> I HAVEN'T HAD CONVERSATIONS WITH ME RUNNING FOR SENATE OR
WITH ME RUNNING FOR SENATE OR DOGCATCHER.
DOGCATCHER. >>'S ONLY ONE ELECTED DOGCATCHER
>>'S ONLY ONE ELECTED DOGCATCHER IN AMERICA ANYMORE, BUT -- NERD
IN AMERICA ANYMORE, BUT -- NERD KNOWLEDGE.
KNOWLEDGE. >> BUT HE NEVER SAID TO YOU,
>> BUT HE NEVER SAID TO YOU, STACEY, I'D LOVE TO HAVE YOU
STACEY, I'D LOVE TO HAVE YOU JOIN ME ON THE TICKET.
JOIN ME ON THE TICKET. >> HE DID NOT T. WE DID NOT TALK
>> HE DID NOT T. WE DID NOT TALK ABOUT HIS PRIMARY STAT JI AND
ABOUT HIS PRIMARY STAT JI AND MOST OF THE SPECULATION COMES
MOST OF THE SPECULATION COMES ABOUT BECAUSE OF WELL WISHERS
ABOUT BECAUSE OF WELL WISHERS WHO GOT EXCITED ABOUT SEEING US
WHO GOT EXCITED ABOUT SEEING US TOGETHER AND I APPRECIATE THEIR
TOGETHER AND I APPRECIATE THEIR ENTHUSIASM.
ENTHUSIASM. I THINK IT IT IS DEEPLY
I THINK IT IT IS DEEPLY PROBLEMATIC THAT THEY ARE MAKING
PROBLEMATIC THAT THEY ARE MAKING THINGS UP BUT I DO NOT BELIEVE
THINGS UP BUT I DO NOT BELIEVE YOU RUN FOR SECOND PLACE AND I
YOU RUN FOR SECOND PLACE AND I DO NOT INTEND TO ENTER A
DO NOT INTEND TO ENTER A PRESIDENTIAL RACE AS A PRIMARY
PRESIDENTIAL RACE AS A PRIMARY CANDIDATE FOR VICE PRESIDENT.
CANDIDATE FOR VICE PRESIDENT. IF I ENTER THE RACE FOR
IF I ENTER THE RACE FOR PRESIDENT I WILL ENTER THE RACE
PRESIDENT I WILL ENTER THE RACE FOR PRESIDENT, BUT ONCE WE HAVE
FOR PRESIDENT, BUT ONCE WE HAVE A NOMINEE, I AM OPEN TO HAVING
A NOMINEE, I AM OPEN TO HAVING CONVERSATIONS SHOULD I NOT BE
CONVERSATIONS SHOULD I NOT BE SOMEONE WHO'S RUNNING I AM OPEN
SOMEONE WHO'S RUNNING I AM OPEN TO CONVERSATIONS WITH ANYONE.
TO CONVERSATIONS WITH ANYONE. >> THAT SPECULATION REALLY
>> THAT SPECULATION REALLY ANNOYED ME QUITE FRANKLY BECAUSE
ANNOYED ME QUITE FRANKLY BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T SEE ANY SPECULATION
YOU DIDN'T SEE ANY SPECULATION THAT BETO SHOULD BE BIDEN'S VICE
THAT BETO SHOULD BE BIDEN'S VICE PRESIDENT AND IT JUST SEEMED
PRESIDENT AND IT JUST SEEMED LIKE -- AND NOT EVEN COMING FROM
LIKE -- AND NOT EVEN COMING FROM BIDEN'S CAMP, WHOEVER IT WAS
BIDEN'S CAMP, WHOEVER IT WAS THAT WAS THE UNNAMED SOURCING
THAT WAS THE UNNAMED SOURCING BUT IN YOUR BOOK YOU TALK ABOUT
BUT IN YOUR BOOK YOU TALK ABOUT THE CHALLENGES THAT WOMEN
THE CHALLENGES THAT WOMEN SPECIFICALLY FACE IN POLITICS
SPECIFICALLY FACE IN POLITICS AND CAN YOU JUST KIND OF DISCUSS
AND CAN YOU JUST KIND OF DISCUSS THAT IN THE CONTEXT OF HOW YOU
THAT IN THE CONTEXT OF HOW YOU WOULD APPROACH A 2020 BID OR A
WOULD APPROACH A 2020 BID OR A 2020 SENATE RUN?
2020 SENATE RUN? >> I THINK FIRST OF ALL, WE HAVE
>> I THINK FIRST OF ALL, WE HAVE TO ACKNOWLEDGE ANY CONSTRAINTS
TO ACKNOWLEDGE ANY CONSTRAINTS THAT PEOPLE SEE WHEN THEY SEE
THAT PEOPLE SEE WHEN THEY SEE US.
US. I'M A BLACK WOMAN WITH NATURAL
I'M A BLACK WOMAN WITH NATURAL HAIR AND A STURDY BUILD AND
HAIR AND A STURDY BUILD AND THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO DISCOUNT MY
THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO DISCOUNT MY CAPACITY FOR LEADERSHIP BASED ON
CAPACITY FOR LEADERSHIP BASED ON PURELY THOSE ISSUES.
PURELY THOSE ISSUES. WE HAVE TO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT.
WE HAVE TO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT. YOU CAN'T IGNORE HOW PEOPLE
YOU CAN'T IGNORE HOW PEOPLE BEHAVE.
BEHAVE. THE ISSUE IS WHAT DO YOU DO WITH
THE ISSUE IS WHAT DO YOU DO WITH THAT INFORMATION?
THAT INFORMATION? I TALK ABOUT IT.
I TALK ABOUT IT. I DON'T PRETEND YOU CAN'T SEE
I DON'T PRETEND YOU CAN'T SEE ME, BUT I ALSO MAKE CERTAIN THAT
ME, BUT I ALSO MAKE CERTAIN THAT YOU UNDERSTAND THAT I'M
YOU UNDERSTAND THAT I'M INCREDIBLY SMART, I'M VERY
INCREDIBLY SMART, I'M VERY CAPABLE AND MY RESPONSIBILITY IS
CAPABLE AND MY RESPONSIBILITY IS TO THEN LAYER ON WHAT YOU SEE,
TO THEN LAYER ON WHAT YOU SEE, MAKE SURE YOU KNOW WHO I AM.
MAKE SURE YOU KNOW WHO I AM. BUT THE OTHER PROBLEM AND I
BUT THE OTHER PROBLEM AND I THINK TO YOUR POINT, THE LARGER
THINK TO YOUR POINT, THE LARGER RESPONSIBILITY OF EVERY WOMAN
RESPONSIBILITY OF EVERY WOMAN RUNNING FOR OFFICE IS WE HAVE TO
RUNNING FOR OFFICE IS WE HAVE TO PUSH BACK AGAINST THOSE STEREO
PUSH BACK AGAINST THOSE STEREO TYPE WHO IS DIMINISH WHO WE ARE
TYPE WHO IS DIMINISH WHO WE ARE OR THAT ANIMATE AND AMPLIFY A
OR THAT ANIMATE AND AMPLIFY A LESSER QUALITY IN A MAN.
LESSER QUALITY IN A MAN. WE ARE MORE THAN CAPABLE.
WE ARE MORE THAN CAPABLE. I JOKINGLY SAY SOMETIMES MEN CAN
I JOKINGLY SAY SOMETIMES MEN CAN LOOK IN THE MIRROR AND HAVE A
LOOK IN THE MIRROR AND HAVE A GOOD HAIR DAY AND BECOME
GOOD HAIR DAY AND BECOME PRESIDENT.
PRESIDENT. WOMEN HAVE TO HAVE A PHD AND
WOMEN HAVE TO HAVE A PHD AND PUSH TO BECOME PRESIDENT.
PUSH TO BECOME PRESIDENT. BUT WHAT I WANT FOLKS TO
BUT WHAT I WANT FOLKS TO UNDERSTAND IS THAT CHANGE IS
UNDERSTAND IS THAT CHANGE IS DIFFERENT OR DIFFERENCE IS NOT
DIFFERENT OR DIFFERENCE IS NOT THERE.
THERE. THERE ARE ALWAYS GOING TO BE
THERE ARE ALWAYS GOING TO BE BARRIERS.
BARRIERS. YOU CAN EITHER CIRCUMVENT THEM,
YOU CAN EITHER CIRCUMVENT THEM, YOU CAN HACK THEM OR DESTROY
YOU CAN HACK THEM OR DESTROY THEM AND SO THE BOOK IS DESIGNED
THEM AND SO THE BOOK IS DESIGNED TO GIVE YOU TIPS ON HOW TO DO
TO GIVE YOU TIPS ON HOW TO DO ALL THREE.
ALL THREE. >> STACEY ABRAMS, STAY IN THE
>> STACEY ABRAMS, STAY IN THE GAME, PLEASE.
GAME, PLEASE. IT'S GREAT TO HAVE YOU ON THE
IT'S GREAT TO HAVE YOU ON THE SHOW.
SHOW. COME BACK.
COME BACK. >> AND STILL AHEAD, DEMOCRATS
>> AND STILL AHEAD, DEMOCRATS MAKE MOVES IN HOPES OF FINALLY
MAKE MOVES IN HOPES OF FINALLY GETTING DONALD TRUMP'S TAX
GETTING DONALD TRUMP'S TAX RETURNS.
RETURNS. PLUS, THE BIG FRONT PAGE STORY
PLUS, THE BIG FRONT PAGE STORY ON THIS MORNING'S "NEW YORK
ON THIS MORNING'S "NEW YORK TIMES."
TIMES." MEMBERS OF ROBERT MUELLER'S TEAM
MEMBERS OF ROBERT MUELLER'S TEAM BELIEVES THE SPECIAL COUNSEL'S
BELIEVES THE SPECIAL COUNSEL'S FINDINGS WERE MORE DAMAGING FOR

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